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If you’ve ever wondered why ADHD is suddenly being talked about so much among women in their 40s and 50s, you’re not alone - and this powerful episode of Two Women Chatting goes right to the heart of it. In this special conversation, GP and women’s health expert Dr Helen Wall joins Michelle to unpack ADHD in midlife , why symptoms often magnify during perimenopause and menopause, and why so many women are being diagnosed only now - or beginning to suspect ADHD for the first time. We explore the overlap between hormone fluctuations , executive function struggles , and the daily pressures of being in the sandwich generation , plus how years of masking have hidden ADHD traits in plain sight. Dr Helen breaks down what ADHD really looks like in women, why it’s often misunderstood, and how understanding your brain can be genuinely life-changing. This blog includes the full transcript of the episode, offering practical advice on recognising symptoms, navigating diagnosis, making the most of GP appointments, and celebrating the strengths and superpowers that come with an ADHD brain. If you’re curious, confused, or on your own midlife ADHD journey, this is the perfect place to start. Full episode is available on all podcast platforms or click here . Dr Helen Wall Today on To Women Chatting we're diving into a topic that feels very close to home to me, ADHD in midlife women… and I couldn't think of anyone better to help unpack it than Dr Helen Wall. You might recognise Helen as one of TV's favourite doctors, as resident GP for BBC Breakfast, BBC Morning Live and a columnist for Women Magazine. She's a women's health specialist and an all-around voice of sense and science when it comes to understanding how our hormones, brains and busy lives collide. Now if you've been around here a while you'll know I was diagnosed with ADHD a few years ago so I'm on this journey too juggling menopause, midlife, motherhood and about thousand open tabs in my brain. So in this episode we're going to talk about what ADHD can look like for women later in life, why so many of us are only getting diagnosed now and how to manage the overwhelm with a little more self-compassion and maybe a little less caffeine! Let's just say if you've ever walked into a room tripped over your suitcase from the holiday you returned from a week ago, find that you're doing the same wash multiple times over because you've forgotten to put it in the dryer and your time blindness is an inside family joke. This episode is for you! And here is Dr. Helen Wall. Welcome to the show. Dr Helen Well thank you for having me here and that's a brilliant segue into exactly what we'll be talking about today. Michelle It is, you are so passionate about this, aren't you? What draws you so much to this particular area? Because you are a GP, so you cover all parts of medicine, menopause as well, but so frequently you post about this and you're passionate about raising awareness, aren't you? Dr Helen Yeah, I mean I've always had an interest in women's health. did actually apply for run through training to be an obstetrician gynaecologist and I was actually very heavily pregnant with my first child then and decided to go into general practice. So although I love being a GP, that love for advocating for women and making sure women get the right care that they need has always been there. I think that probably stems back to my mum who was a midwife and I grew up obviously with her having that same passion. yeah, every time I've done anything in my career as a GP, it's always drawn me back into working to advocate and help women get the right care. And it's such a frustrating area of medicine that women don't get the care that they need and there's still so much disparity and inequality I feel for women in medicine. That's something that I'm really passionate about trying to change. It's a huge, huge thing to change, but little by little, things like this, we can all do a little bit to do that. I've got a particular interest in ADHD. My daughter, who's now 17, has a diagnosis of that. I recognise many of these traits in her, and I started to see it quite commonly in my menopause clinic that I run, an NHS menopause clinic for our primary care network, I started to see women that I just thought there was something else going on here and started to recognise traits that I'd recognised in my daughter and vice versa. I became a bit passionate because I didn't want my daughter to get to the point of being in midlife, having missed opportunities, having felt that she'd struggled all her life to get to the point where she suddenly had a light bulb moment and everything imploded. So that's where that sort of grew from really, wanting to get things better for women. Michelle I think a lot of people have heard now about neurodivergence, you know back in 30 years ago when women were going through menopause it wasn't talked about it, wasn't really recognised so can you give me a brief 101 on what ADHD is Dr Helen Well, it's a neurodevelopmental disorder. And I think that's a really key  point that we need to make here, because I think there's a lot of hype around at the minute about it being a trend and about it, there being no test for it. So therefore, people just jumping on the bandwagon and people are describing symptoms that everybody's got as having ADHD. And it's absolutely not that. We've got really, really clear evidence that there are functional and structural differences in the brains of those people with ADHD, so how the brain looks and how it works in terms of the neurotransmitters and the chemical messengers and how they function. And we've got evidence that there is genetic predisposition and certain gene loci, so parts of genes that lead to neurodivergence, in particular ADHD and autism.  We have real evidence that this is a real thing that exists but despite that we're still getting particularly women told that they've not got ADHD and that they're overthinking things and it's just part of growing up it's just part of menopause and so on and that really really grates on me . Michelle Me too. That gender bias is so, it's still enormous, isn't it? Because, you know, traditionally we thought of little boys jumping up and down on sofas and being sort of slightly out of control as being ADHD. But little girls were so often told to sit still, be quiet, behave. And that masking behaviour, we've carried that for decades. Dr Helen Wall So let's switch quickly because there is so much ground I need to cover with you. Why are women now starting to get diagnosed in midlife? Dr Helen Well, I think for things like this, really, I think we're talking about it a lot more. And I think something that has changed in the last couple of years is we've actually started to look at how female hormones impact the female brain. It's absolutely ludicrous that in 2025, I'm sitting here saying, but in 2023, there was the first study done that looked at how female hormones can impact on our brain, for years. I went to medical school, I did lots of GP training, I've worked in medicine for 20 years and we never talk generally day to day about the fact that oestrogen and progesterone affects how a woman's brain functions, it affects how she thinks, it affects the ability for her to process information, to retain memories, to you know get up and go. All of these things are driven by chemical messengers like for everybody but also by our sex hormones and the first study was done in 2023 looking at how hormones impacted menopause, so why do women become depressed, anxious, etc. Why do they get brain fog in perimenopause and menopause? And then they started to link it back to, actually because our sex hormones are starting to fluctuate or dip. I think from that we've got to extrapolate that into all different aspects of medicine, including neurodivergence. really escalating information and research now to show that those drop-in fluctuations in our sex hormones impact how the brain works in neurodivergence as well as the general female brain. And I think once you get a movement going and people start to talk about these things more, exactly what you're doing here today, which is fantastic by the way, people start to think, women start to think, hang on a minute, I'm not just ditzy or lazy or disorganised and actually there's something else going on here.  Numerous women and people contact me day in day out on my Instagram channel about the fact that they've struggled all their lives yet seemingly been perfectly in control, they've got good careers, they've managed a household, a family. To the outside world, they look like they've been flying but the cost of that, the internal cost of that is so great that those women often end up burnt out, tired, exhausted, and just everything imploding once our hormones start to fluctuate and deplete in perimenopause. Michelle it's almost like a perfect storm, isn't it? So we're coming to midlife, we've got different kinds of concerns. We might be changing careers or feeling that those menopause symptoms impact our work life. We might have elderly parents as well as adult kids to worry about and care for. And we might have partners that perhaps we, know, the silver divorce is huge. You know, we might be finding that we're tracking differently in relationships. Dr Helen Yes. Michelle So all of a sudden we've got this hormone dip and in a way, as you said, it's that burnout. We can't take it anymore and something's got to give. Dr Helen It's the perfect storm, isn't it? It's that perfect storm of everything lining up. We often talk in medicine about the Swiss cheese model. I'm sure other industries talk about it as well, where everything just lines up.  Each of those things on its own wouldn't lead to a complete catastrophe. But once you line all those things up, you're just heading to a really dark place. women have been doing that. People say to me, well, why has this suddenly happened now? Why are we suddenly diagnosing this now? It's not because it's new. I don't truly believe that the number of women with ADHD has risen in the last two, three, four, five years. I think we've empowered women to recognise it and start to talk about it and start to ask for help more and that's why it's gone up considerably. And it needs to continue to go up because I believe there's still a considerable number of women who are suffering and struggling in this space but haven’t got a clue what's going on for them and I hear from those women day in and day out on my Instagram channel. Michelle You know, in a funny way. I could almost equate it to the Esther Rantzen effect of Childline, that there were always kids being abused, but they didn't know how to let people know. Now we've gone through menopause as well, where, as a female community, we've really gathered together and raised awareness and shared symptoms. Now we're onto ADHD. And I agree with you, I think we've always had it, but we've managed those symptoms and now the overwhelm is so much. We’re now at a point where because our parents are living longer. A generation ago, sadly, those parents probably wouldn't be around now. So we wouldn't still be sandwiched right in the middle of both those things. Dr Helen Let's not forget, we're not that far away from when women couldn't get a mortgage on their own without permission from their father or their husbands. I think I read, I think it was what, 1997 or something ridiculous like that. I can't remember the year now, but I remember thinking I was a teenager at the time. It wasn't that far along ago, but actually now women are working in the workplace like men work in the workplace. We're running a home where we're literally doing everything. This is not me slagging off men, but we've added on that right to be in leadership roles, in work, running successful businesses, et cetera, that maybe women weren't doing as much even a generation ago and that adds a lot of pressure. So we're doing all these things, we're living longer. So I think years ago when women used to go into perimenopause and menopause,that was sort of a signal that they were coming towards the end of their life really - women lived to what, 50s, 60s? Now women are living into their 80s. We're spending half our lives not having been through perimenopause or menopause. So it's a significant chunk. And as you said, parents are living much longer. People may have had children later on. So they've got teenage children who are also hormonal when they get to that point in their life. It is just an absolute, yeah. Michelle That is an excellent point Helen because we used to have kids in our 20s and now so many of us are having kids in our 30s or even 40s. So you know in the normal order of things back in the day by the time your daughter was 23 she would have moved out and had kids and that would not be your responsibility and, sadly, your parents may not be with you but also you are not thinking at the age of 50 let's do a career pivot let's start an Etsy shop or let's let’s,train as a nutritionist because that's been my passion all my life. Now we are literally looking at halfway through not halfway done and thank goodness we are starting to provide support and recognition. Let's have a look at some of the symptoms that are typical of ADHD and maybe particularly typical of midlife women if you can share some of those. Dr Helen So I think you mentioned earlier, didn't you, about masking? And masking is a huge thing for these women. You know, the symptoms that they've had have often not been the typical. Even I've got colleagues now who still think that ADHD is about being impulsive, about running around the classroom throwing chairs. Actually, a lot of the symptoms for women, particularly women who've got to this point and not been diagnosed, have been internalised . So they've been those things of constantly sort of having been struggling to process, to switch tasks, to keep on task and so on, but internalising that in terms of worry, anxiety, feeling like they have to mask to seem that they are on top of things, but actually having to prepare a lot for everything that they do. So I had one lady say to me that if she went to a meeting, she was a very high flying businesswoman, but she would prepare for three hours for one business meeting and she would be up to 11pm/midnight just to do that because she wanted to go into that meeting fully informed and fully on top of everything but she couldn't trust herself to be able to do that in the moment. She had to have everything completely prepped because the cognition and her pathways in the brain couldn't process that information quickly enough and a lot of the symptoms that women have are more of that thing really that preparation, brain execution, rather than the impulsivity. And if they do have impulsivity and hyperactivity, it tends to be very internalised. So it's that unable to switch off, unable to rest, fidgeting, getting in bed at night and not being able to stop that mind turning . I'd be interested to hear what symptoms you had, Michelle, and what led you to sort of think. Michelle I'm glad you mentioned that because I think this is another reason that women my age are starting to get diagnosed is because we're looking at our kids differently.  So our kids are coming through school and it might be flagged up that their behaviour could be ADHD or neurodivergent, which is what happened to me. I had a lot of guilt actually because when my daughter was seven, eight, nine, ten, she had a very high IQ. That came through in her academics but she was so scatty. There wasn't a week that went by that she didn't lose something, forget her homework, find quizzes and tests really difficult, getting things done in order. We didn't know what that was. And she was diagnosed with auditory processing disorder. Later on, as she became 18, 19, 20, and I think this happens a lot when kids go to university and you lose that kind of helicopter parenting because we're still there as a support network. When they're on their own, it kind of implodes a little bit because they've got to be an adult in an academic situation. And she didn't do that great. She managed to get through. Now when I look back, I am unbelievably proud of how she managed to navigate that process without meds, without diagnosis - and it was after she went to university, we did suggest maybe she should maybe just go and chat to somebody. Let's see… Sure enough, she was diagnosed as ADHD. And as I did a podcast on this, this is four years ago when I first started Two Women Chatting and I got an expert in to talk about it, about adult kids. I'm like, hello, are you talking about her or me now? What is going on? And isn't it though? So then you start looking at yourself and thinking, gosh, apple and tree. This is extraordinary. Dr Helen Yes, that's so common. Michelle But I also feel like you mentioned right at the beginning there, the hopping on the bandwagon, the trend. It's almost embarrassing to then go and say, I wonder if I've got it too. Because my family did react like, here we go, Mum. Yeah, yeah, you as well. Definitely. They're used to it now and they accept it. But that feeling of being gaslit or will my doctor just dismiss it as menopause? Let's go down that route, shall we? Because the mix up between is it perimenopausal or menopausal symptoms at our age? We don't know. How do we recognise whether it's more than that? Dr Helen Yeah, it's super hard and this is something I talk about a lot on my Instagram channel. It's hard for women to decide what's going on. What I always say is, if you have ADHD, that's not just appeared in perimenopause and menopause. That might be when you recognise it or when people around you recognise it. But actually, if you sit down and really think, which can be hard for someone with ADHD,I get that! But maybe don't sit down. Maybe walk about and really think about your childhood and how you were in your teenage years. And often at each point for women, when the hormones dishevelled a little bit. So often we will notice a distinct bit of unravelling, as I like to call it, around puberty and then perhaps when they've had a baby. And then again, when they hit perimenopause because it's that impact of those hormonal fluxes, that impact on brain chemical messaging but usually the symptoms or always the symptoms should have been present at least from under age 12 . Sometimes I'll say to women have you got any old school reports because they might not remember what was said but actually if you trace it back really carefully you can usually see if you speak to family speak to mum dad they'll always have just put it down nine times out of ten to she was just scatty she lost everything all the time. S he couldn't sit and take anything in. She couldn't process information, but that was just her. And it's not been recognised as an actual thing.  It's just been labelled as something that you do and your personality. But actually, if you link it right back and go right back to childhood and then through your teens and into adulthood, you'll start to piece together where things perhaps didn't quite fit. And what women will often say to me is, I've never really felt normal. I've never really felt, I've always felt there's something different about me or I've never really understood why I couldn't do that easily like everybody else. There's always some kind of little thing that they say that just sort of stabs you in the heart but then you think, gosh, why have we missed this for so long? That was the real thing that I didn't want my daughter to have to go through, moving forwards in life because I'd seen it in so many women. But I have to hold my hands up and say I'm not perfect.,.  I'm registered menopause specialist now, but I wasn't then. And I've probably missed it in lots of women. And, you know, I'm not proud of that, but  it's about being open and honest and saying, it's okay that we've missed it in our patients, but we need to change that moving forwards because things do need to change. I think I've probably also got a little bit of ADHD. People say, well, everybody's got a bit of ADHD, but, we recognise it in our children. I know -and I certainly have recognised traits in my daughter, in myself. You know, everybody's journey is different, isn't it? I'm not in a place where I want to go down that road of being diagnosed, et cetera, but I understand why some women do and we need to accept that everybody's an individual and we need to do what they need for that support. Sometimes it's not about jumping on medication it's just about getting that validation of why you struggled for so long, why you've had to over prepare for everything, why you've constantly felt restless and let's talk a little bit about that rejection sensitivity dysphoria  that women get because that is huge isn't it and the emotional turmoil Michelle Yes, please. It's massive! People don't understand how awful that is, how you always feel. I've had this podcast for four years and people say, you've done really, really well. I'm like, no, not really. But everything is magnified to a degree that you think, someone, especially with social media. my goodness. It's awful. Click to pre-order - published May 2026 Dr Helen Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And I think we need a whole new term for ADHD for women, if I'm honest. I think attention deficit hyperactivity disorder just does not, it does not show what's on the tin at all. Not what's in the tin, is it? You know, it's completely different for women. It's often not about attention deficit. It's about attention difference.  Often they've got very good attention for some things and absolutely no attention for others. But for women, the huge part of ADHD is that emotional dysregulation.  And that gets ever more difficult when our hormones go into flux. So in puberty, when we've had a baby, when we are in perimenopause and menopause, we already know, because of what I was talking about before with the effect of hormones on our brain, that hormonal flux impacts our brain in terms of anxiety, memory, brain fog, depression. And when you've got ADHD, those things are already challenged because your dopamine levels are often not functioning well or not being read properly or lower than the normal. And the estrogen impacts that as well. So things definitely go into spiral. And emotional dysregulation is a huge part of that. And I think we don't talk about that enough and the impact that that has. Michelle Do you think that's why so many people who later discover they've got ADHD may have been either dismissed by their GPs or just offered antidepressants because it kind of shows itself in a sadness or a not fitting in or can't put my finger on it kind of thing? Dr Helen Yeah, absolutely and one of the things I always say to GP colleagues, and I'm a GP trainer as well so I try and drum this into my GP trainees, is treatment resistant depression and anxiety we shouldn't yes okay we might change with anxiety and depression you have to start one medication change to another and so on but if a lady is coming back to us time and time again - I've had ladies that I've seen where they've been in and out with anxiety and depression throughout most of adult life from teenage years and they've never got better. Why have they not got better? And often it's because we've not got the root cause. So I'm not saying that you can't have anxiety and depression if you've got ADHD. You absolutely can. The two can coexist. But what I am saying is what we're not very good at is looking at why is this person not getting better with the treatment? What else is going on for this person? And sometimes, very often in fact, there's an underlying neurodivergence that's been missed or not recognised and that person has therefore been treated with medication for anxiety and depression. Some of that may be absolutely right because we know that if you're neurodivergent you're more at risk of becoming anxious and depressed because of the struggles of living in a world that is forcing you to be neurotypical effectively and the brain differences that happen.  But we shouldn't just be reliant, we shouldn't just be labelling those people as that without looking at what else is going on for them. Michelle It would be a good thing at this point to mention that there's emerging evidence that ADHD people react differently to medications. So what might work for a non neurodivergent person might spiral somebody else. Can you just talk a little on that? Dr Helen Yes, there is very much emerging evidence about the way that our or people with ADHD and neurodivergence of their enzymes work, the way the brain reacts to medication and you know we see this particularly in hormones as well so I talk quite a bit about progesterone and how women with underlying neurodivergence often react very differently to them. That's the same for many medications, particularly medications that affect our GABA receptors. Our GABA receptors are those receptors that are our calming receptors. So that's the receptors that if you take a sleeping tablet or you take a relaxant like Diazepam, Valium, or you have that glass of wine when you're really stressed on a Friday night, it hits those receptors and you just feel that first dull of calm. We know that those can vary in women who are neurodivergent and therefore, we really should be looking a bit closer at how we manage these women with different medications and the same with antidepressants, but unfortunately we don't really have the guidance on that because the studies and the evidence is just really coming to the surface. It's certainly not something that we think about in day-to-day clinical practice. I'm not going to sit here and say that I can change women's medications based on me knowing that they're neurodivergent because we just haven't got the information to do that. What I can say is that I can be very mindful of the fact that they may not react how we expect them to and things may not pan out as we expect them to. So I often try and set that expectation and have a very reassuring threshold for tweaking and tailoring things and not being too disheartened when things don't go to plan and that's all we can really do I think at this point in time until that research becomes more and then it gets embedded into clinical guidance and practice. Michelle Now some women are quite fearful about going to their GP for a diagnosis in case they're not  ADHD. There's that hypersensitivity again, we're going to get rejected, we haven't even got the ADHD that we thought we did. But of course, you know, there's so many kids who are in line trying to get ADHD treatment. The NHS is overwhelmed with helping cases and I don't know if they do it on a priority basis, kids first, women later. But because of waiting so much and potentially worried about getting rejected, lots of people are self-diagnosing. And I think this adds to the, ‘everyone's got a bit of ADHD', everyone's jumping on the trend. It's not necessarily that. What is your ‘doctor take’ on going the self-diagnosis route, at least to start with? Dr Helen I really advocate for that. I call it self-identifying as ADHD and I think it's something that we should be encouraging women to do because not every woman is going to want or benefit from medication. So I think you have to weigh up for yourself what are the benefits of me getting a formal diagnosis here. So sometimes women want a formal or need a formal diagnosis because without it they're not going to feel validated, they're not going to get the support from their family and friends, from their workplace. They're going to want medication which you absolutely can't get without a formal ADHD diagnosis and even then as you've said it's a struggle. But I think if you are somebody who is genuinely really struggling and have struggled throughout life there are so many resources out there that you can access without a formal diagnosis of ADHD. There's so many support groups, there's online resources on places like ADHD UK, Facebook groups, you can really tap into quite a wealth of support from other women who are going through the same. And I think there's no harm in doing that. fact, I think it's quite beneficial to do that if you're not somebody who is needing that necessarily, formal diagnosis. And even if you are somebody that's going for that, we know that the wait times are so lengthy now that doing that in the meantime can be quite helpful - just to get that support because it's a lonely, lonely place I think for women and they need that support. Michelle It really is and I feel like if you are going for that self diagnosis and you can start putting practices in place and advocating for yourself and honestly giving yourself permission to fail sometimes. One of the things that I think having the diagnosis has done for me and for many women I know with ADHD is having that label that makes them feel like they're seen, that they're not stupid, disorganised, lazy, any of those things that you can be so self-critical about or have from partners, families, like laughing at you.  I cannot tell you how many events and concert tickets, I still regret the Robbie Williams concert back in the 90s that I missed! I realise now that that I've given myself permission sometimes, if my social battery wears out and things like that, we're so much more aware post pandemic of how throwing ourselves into social situations does drain our batteries and now if I've got several events during the week I think no I'm going to need a day off where I can lay on the sofa and play Candy Crush Saga and it's alright because I'm going give my brain a little bit of a break and it has helped me operate better - so from that perspective I would encourage anybody even if it is to find out that you're going through perimenopause or menopause and maybe there's things that could help you through HRT or natural remedies or exercise. I think fundamentally we need to be kind to ourselves and allow ourselves to diagnose whatever is making us feel like something's ‘off’. Dr Helen Yeah, absolutely. It's that self-compassion, isn't it? And that permission to rest and that permission to care for yourself. And I think so many women are bad at that generally, whether they've got ADHD or not. think we run around, don't we, looking after everybody else, trying to be perfect, trying to be on top of everything. we've got to, in general, think women are bad at giving themselves that space, but particularly women with ADHD who've spent their life trying to stay on top of everything and keep up with everything and then hit this period of their life where the hormones go into flux. It's so disabling for them. I've actually got a book coming out next year about this and it talks about that very thing about how we, it gives you some tools and tips on how to sort self-identify and really sort of tap into just doing exactly what you said, just looking after yourself and getting the most out of yourself and your brain really. Michelle I’d like to end on a really uplifting note because one of the things I think about ADHD and we can bandy around the words like superpower  but a lot of creative people have it and a lot of people in emergency situations are remarkable in those times. Kate Garroway has just admitted that you know she's just done celebrity traitors and she is now pursuing an ADHD diagnosis after talking to Cat Burns who is very open about her autism and her ADHD, Martine McCutcheon, Nadia Sawalha, Denise Welsh. I could go on and on about a number of celebrities who are thankfully giving their voice and admitting that they've got ADHD. I think it's a really good thing. So I personally feel like I can lean into creativity. I really feel like being neurodivergent has given me the edge on thinking beyond laterally. I can get a problem, I can get into it and I can come up with odd, different solutions to how I either solve it, promote it or get people on my show and I, I never stop. So let's talk a little bit about the upside of having ADHD . Dr Helen There's so many upsides, aren't there?  I read once that they thought originally it was some kind of evolutionary benefit having ADHD, that the people that were neurodivergent actually were the people that survived best in the wild, because of that ability to sort of not stop, not rest, just get on and see problems and often people with ADHD, women with ADHD particularly, but people with ADHD are often very emotionally intelligent and intuitive and they can read a room and they can read a situation. I've seen that to be true in so many instances. I got a message from somebody who's on Instagram and it said, you know, I've been told I can't have ADHD because I've got a successful career and I've never been in trouble with the police as a teenager. I mean, what an absolute load of rubbish. Some of the most successful people I've met have got ADHD or are neurodivergent in some form or other because they're just so driven and intuitive and they just get on with things and they can hyperfocus and just achieve and create and drive forwards and you know the energy that they often exude is second to none. So I think you know it's not a problem having ADHD if you're allowed to live with ADHD rather than try and live in a neurotypical world and be forced into those pigeon holes that you necessarily don't fit into.   So I truly believe it's the society around us that causes the issues with ADHD and particularly women with ADHD, not actually the ADHD itself. The problem that we've got is that we're not very good at supporting women or enabling them to get that support because for so long we've covered it up and just allowed women to mask and headlong into burnout and that needs to change  and doing things like this is the exact reason why I'm doing that because I think together we can help make that change. Michelle There is a reason why GCHQ, the house of spies if you like, actively recruit people with neurodivergence because of their problem solving skills. One last thing actually Helen, when people go to the doctor, they've got a short amount of time, how can they maximise the time that they've got to try and get some help? What should they do in advance? Dr Helen I would definitely recommend that you do a screening test for ADHD. It's a really crude measure. You can find it on most ADHD websites, ADHD UK, there's one on there. It's a crude measure and it doesn't give you the full picture, but it just enables the GPs to focus their mind. I would go with information about not just the symptoms you've got, but how it has affected you. So if you feel like you've been masking, actually talk about the cost of that masking and the fact that it might look like you've got a good career and you've done all these things and it doesn't look like it, probably have. But the cost of that and the internal restlessness and burnout that that's caused and I would try and link that back to childhood if you can because the GP will be looking to see that this isn't something that's just happened in perimenopause, menopause or post-childbirth or something, it's something that's been neurodevelopmental and throughout the life course so you need to provide a little bit of information about that. I always say this to people and I completely understand how this happens. I'm very pro advocating for women and women with neurodivergence and if I see a lady who doesn't know that and she comes in to see me, often they come in very defensive and expecting a fight basically and that can be really hard dynamic then to come back from in a consultation. I think try and park every dismissal, everything you've had. I know this is really hard and it's easy for me to say one side and go in with a fresh mind with the information you've got and have a clear ask that you want to be referred for X, Y or Z or you want to be, you you want to have a look at your menopause or whatever and go in fresh and open and give the GP a chance because I think sometimes it's hard when people have seen other GPs or with the healthcare pressures or they've had problems from family who've dismissed them and they come in and they're very argumentative and on the attack and the consultation just spirals nowhere. So that would be my best advice just to go in open-minded with the information with a clear ask for what you want and if you don't get what you want and you d on't get where you think you need to be then it's absolutely fine to go to go again to a different GP. Don't feel that you have to write that off. You can keep going and ask for a second opinion. You can do that with anything. Michelle and use the resources that are out there. Your Instagram channel is brilliant. You've pinned up some really, really wonderful explanations of how people should go about getting that diagnosis, what they should be looking for and how they should keep records. Michelle I would really, really advocate for women if they are feeling like they need to get that diagnosis. Don't be put off by the imposter syndrome, the ‘I'm going to be rejected’. It is weirdly empowering just to know, not to like shout it from the hilltops. It's your private information but it might just help you deal with the burnout, the constant juggling, just so much that goes on in midlife. Helen, thank you so much for joining me today. You've been really, really informative. Thank you. Follow Helen on instagram @doctorhelenwall or take a look at her website www.tvhealthdoctor.com Helen’s book Menopause and ADHD: How to navigate hormone flux and neurodivergence  will be out in May 2026. Pre-order here What ADHD Looks Like in Midlife Women Why Hormones Make ADHD Symptoms More Noticeable How to Prepare for an ADHD Appointment The Positives and Strengths of an ADHD Brain Why ADHD in Women Is Not a Trend Some excellent resources and instagram accounts: ADHD Love - just the best explanations in a really warm way Alex Partridge podcast and instagram @adhd_chatter_podcast ADHD Women's Wellbeing podcast and instagram NHS ADHD in Adults link ADHD UK Adult Self Screening Tool link

Number 1 -  I am not a menopause expert (far from it) - but I have gone through it (and out the other side!) and I’ve been lucky enough to to meet and learn from everyone on this list - so I trust them and can recommend them.  But please  do your own research, keep those symptom trackers, advocate for yourself and seek support. Number 2 - this is not an exhaustive or complete list.  There are many many fabulous experts and meno-warriors out there that can help - doctors, coaches, nutritionists, wellbeing experts, healthcare professionals, fitness and exercise coaches. If you listened to my recent Brooklands Radio show dedicated to Menopause Awareness Month , you’ll know how passionate I am about cutting through the noise and menowashing to share genuinely useful advice from trusted experts. After the show, so many of you reached out asking for the resources I mentioned - so I’ve pulled everything together here in one place. Whether you’re in perimenopause, full menopause, or supporting someone who is, this guide is designed to help you feel informed, empowered, and less alone. You’ll find links to expert podcasts, the HRT prepayment certificate, symptom checkers, charities, and menopause organisations I genuinely trust - plus a few of my favourite reads from brilliant women like Kate Muir, Kate Rowe-Ham, and Mariella Frostrup. Because knowledge really is power - and when we understand what’s happening to our bodies, we can make the right choices for our health, our future, and our joy. Trusted Experts Dr Juliet Balfour @menopausehealth Dr Nighat Arif @drnighatarif Dr Naomi Potter @dr_naomipotter Dr Shahzadi Harper @drshahzadiharper Dr Rachel Hines @drrachelhines Trusted instagram accounts/influencers/platforms Jane James @janemhdg - founder of community Facebook page Menopausing and Me with Davina McCall Libby Stevenson @libbystevenson.wellbeing Claire Hattrick @theexecutivemenopausecoach - Menopause in the Workplace Zaowoman - Judith Sprusz - @menopausehealth - education, health coaching and hormones Meera Bhogal @meerabhogal Laura Dowling @Fabulouspharmacist Dr Claire Kaye Career and Confidence Coach Dani Binnington - Menopause and Cancer Kate Muir - @menoscandal menopause campaigner and film-maker (documentary with Davina McCall) Carolyn Harris MP - an incredible supporter of women's health and chairs the All Party Parliamentary Group for Menopause. You can contact her here: carolyn.harris.mp@parliament.uk Michelle Griffith Robinson - Olympian, life coach, women's health advocate Emma Bardwell - nutitionist specialising in women's health and menopause - author of The 30g Plan Great books and author instas great menopause books Owning Your Menopause - Fitter, Calmer, Stronger in 30 Days - Kate Rowe-Ham How to Menopause - Tamsin Fadal Have a Magnificent Menopause - Alison Bladh How to Have a Magnificent Midlife Crisis - Kate Muir Meno-Wars - Fiona Clark The Natural Menopause Method Cookbook - Karen Newby The Feel Good Fix - Lavina Mehta MBE Menopause Yoga and Wellbeing - Petra Coveney Midlife Matters - Katie Taylor @loungelatte Menopausing - Davina McCall and Dr Naomi Potter Cracking the Menopause - Mariella Fostrup and Alice Smellie The Definitive Guide to the  Perimenopause and Menopause - Dr Louise Newson Useful podcasts - they’ve helped me :) T T wo Women Chatting - of course! These episodes in particular: Kate Muir | Midlife Unflitered: Menopause, Mind and Magnificence - click here Kate Rowe-Ham | Own Your Menopause, Fuel Your Power - click here Jenny Eclair | Life After Menopause - click here Emma Skeates | Menopausal Madness - click here Menopause Part 1 - click here Menopause Part 2 - click here Owning Your Menopause with Kate Rowe-Ham Is It Hot in Here - Dr Naomi Potter No Appointment Necessary - Dr Amir Khan and Cherry Healey The Laura Dowling Experience - Laura Dowling So, let’s talk meno-washing . You’ve heard of greenwashing - when brands pretend to be eco-friendly while wrapping everything in plastic? Well, meno-washing is the midlife version. It’s when a company suddenly decides it’s “menopause-friendly” … usually around October… and slaps the word “meno” on absolutely anything.I’m talking menopause toothpaste  (because apparently, your gums need empowerment?), menopause tea  that’s just chamomile with attitude, or the classic “hormone-balancing candle” - like that’s going to regulate your oestrogen! Even workplaces do it - posting about “supporting menopausal women” on social media while keeping the office at 22 degrees and offering zero flexibility or understanding. So here’s the rule: if it doesn’t educate, empower, or genuinely make your day easier - it’s probably meno-washing.Stick with the experts and brands who actually care, not just cash in. If you pay for NHS prescribed HRT medicine 3 or more times in 12 months, an HRT Prepayment Certificate   could save you money. Each item on an NHS prescription usually costs £9.90. You can buy an HRT PPC for a one-off payment of £19.80 (the cost of two single items). Doesn’t cover testosterone though - go to NHS.com  to complete https://health-charge-exemptions.nhsbsa.nhs.uk/buy-hrt-ppc/start And while we're here... getting that glue off from all the patches? Try Nudi spray . Spray on, wipe off. (not an ad and not on commission!) The Stats One study found 25% of women  have “severe symptoms” that significantly impact daily life. On average, symptoms persist for about 4 years  post-period—but in some cases can last up to 12 years . A major UK survey of women aged 40-60 in employment found 73%  experiencing menopausal symptoms. In that same group, 67%  say their symptoms have had a mostly negative  effect on them at work.  Around 10% of women  have left the workforce because of their menopause symptoms. 27% of employed women aged 40-60  say menopause symptoms negatively impacted their career progression — that’s an estimated 1.2 million  women in the UK. Congratulations to the Menopause Mandate for pushing through their MM40plus campaign that has now resulted in menopause being included in the NHS over 40 health check.  Mariella Frostrup and Carolyn Harris have spearheaded the campaign. “Including menopause in the NHS 40+ health check will help millions of women make informed choices about their symptoms and treatment” says Mariella, Chair.  Wes Streeting, Secretary for Health announced the news today. This follows the findings of Menopause Mandate’s 2025 Mega Survey, which gathered responses from more than 15,000 women, and confirmed its previous yearly findings.  If you don't get asked to come in for a 40+ healthcheck by your GP practice, ask them for one! There is no single number for menopause symptoms , as sources cite varying amounts, from over 30 to more than 70, with some lists identifying as many as 62 or 76. These symptoms are often grouped into categories like physical, psychological, cognitive, and sexual health. Symptoms can include common ones like hot flashes and mood swings, as well as less-known effects such as changes in body odor, tinnitus, and electric shock sensations.  Common and widely cited: There are frequently cited lists of around 34 symptoms, which include hot flushes, night sweats, and mood swings.  Other widely recognized symptoms: Other commonly recognized symptoms include joint pain, headaches, changes in skin and hair, trouble sleeping, and brain fog.  Lesser-known symptoms: Some sources identify a much larger range of symptoms, sometimes exceeding 60 or even 70, which can include a wide array of physical and psychological effects. These can include things like:  Changes in body odour  Worsening allergies  Electric shock sensations  Tinnitus (ringing in the ears)  Dry, itchy eyes (which water a lot) Bleeding gums and metallic taste in mouth Irritability and anxiety  Fatigue  Driving anxiety Vertigo and dizziness, clumsiness Download a menopause symptom checker here The Menopause Charity is for all women and other individuals experiencing menopause, as well as their employers, partners, families, friends, and the health professionals supporting them. Some great TV shows that might help: Davina McCall: Sex, Myths and the Menopause - on Channel 4 Davina McCall: Sex, Mind and the Menopause - on Channel 4 💬 Keeping It Real (aka The Disclaimer Bit): Just so we’re clear - no one’s paid me to be here! Every expert, resource, and recommendation I’ve shared in my Midlife Toolkit - Menopause Edition is something I genuinely rate and trust. I’m not a medical expert (though I’ve read enough about HRT and hot flushes to qualify for an honorary PhD in peri-chaos). These are simply the things, people, books and podcasts that have helped me navigate this wild midlife ride. Please, always check with a qualified healthcare professional before making any decisions about your health - Google and I don’t count!

Donna Ashworth “ If you wake up expecting disappointment, expecting misery, expecting things to go wrong, you'll always find disappointment, you'll never be disappointed about that. But if you wake up and you decide, I'm going to seek all the ways in which little things go right, I'm going to look for all the little bits of magic and human connection, then you will never be disappointed because it's absolutely everywhere. ” Michelle : Donna Ashworth is a Sunday Times bestselling poet and author, recently named the UK's number one bestselling female non-fiction author and number two in the world just behind Mel Robbins. That's incredible. She's known for her anthologies that seem to arrive in our lives just when we need them most and her new book Joy Chose You is a collection of poems and reflections that remind us joy isn't something we have to chase, it's something we can allow even in the midst of life's challenges. From grief and change to laughter and love, Donna's words offer a hand to hold and a nudge towards hope. She's built a remarkable community of readers online with over a million people finding daily solace and strength in her posts, proof that words really can be medicine for the soul. Donna, it is truly such a joy to have you here. Welcome to the show. Donna : Aw, thank you. What a gorgeous intro. Michelle : Now you've come a long way from the 'Instagram poet'. I don't think we can even call you that anymore. I think you've gone way beyond just social media platforms because you've had an incredible summer. You've been at so many festivals. You're a prolific author now. You've got another new book that we're going to talk about shortly. And I have to applaud you again, Donna. Last time we spoke, your word of the year was brave for growing brave and one of the things you talked about was overcoming that absolute crippling anxiety of getting on stage and talking to people. Well, I think you've done it, haven't you? Donna : I think I have. Do you know what? It wasn't easy. As with all good things, you know, it was a slog. I had a little bit of hypnotherapy with a lovely man called Jonathan Goodwin who, you know, basically did all he could with me and said, this is done now. What's left here is the self-fulfilling prophecy that is yours to, you know, face off, which is something that so many of us have. You know, we tell ourselves things all the time. And if you have a thought over and over and over, it hardwires, it becomes a belief. So I think midlife for a lot of people, a lot of women especially, is about unpicking those beliefs that actually, are they true? Do we really believe them? And then hardwiring new ones. So my new one is, I love public speaking. It flowed through me with ease. And when I first told myself this over and over, it was a lie. You know, it wasn't true. I didn't love it at all. But I'm glad to say that as with all things, if you repeat them enough and you want it enough, it's become And what I've always enjoyed about getting over the fear of public speaking is what is on the other side of that. And let me tell you what's on the other side. It's loads and loads and loads of amazing women who are just like me and we connect immediately and we have a chat and we overshare. And, you know, all just strangers who are just friends you haven't met yet. So everything good is on the other side of cringe and fear. Something I tell myself all the time. So it's been, you know, it's been hard, but so very worth it. Michelle : But I know one thing that's really important to you is connection, isn't it? And that is something that I think you can pick up in a room or a marquee or wherever you are and you're doing a Fane production talk as well, getting on stage. But it's palpable, isn't it? The way that you feel your words resonate. I'm sure when you're standing on stage behind that mic and you're seeing women listen to your poetry maybe for the first time and you see that light bulb moment like, oh, she's talking to me. That's exactly the way that I feel. That must feel incredibly powerful. Donna : It's amazing. It's the best thing in the world, bar none to me, is that feeling the little goosebumps. You know the way when you’re talking to someone and they say something and either you were just thinking it or you were just about to say it or it resonates with you so hugely that you'll get the little goosey skin and you're like, goosebumps, goosebumps. And to me, that is whatever, in whatever way it's happening. Is it, you know, the brush of someone saying that's, you're right. This is what you need to speak about. This is what I've been trying to tell you. Or is it the frequency of each other connecting and making a little frisson? Whatever it is, it's bigger than us. And you're aware you're in the presence of some sort of connection that just happened. So when that happens, you know, with a couple of hundred people in the same space, it's wonderful. It's just beautiful. Joy Chose You - October 2025 Michelle : You've always been a writer because you've written songs and you've been a magazine writer. And then as we went into COVID, you found poetry to be a really good vessel for you, for your feelings and to share with others, which is where you became the 'Instagram poet'. And When the World Stopped was a poem that was shared across the sea and across the UK, making millions for the NHS. That was really your beginning. And obviously you've come a long way from that. But one of the things that resonated with me and it was just actually on Instagram from you the other day. It stopped me in my tracks because your book is about finding the joy. But I think at the moment, and we'll come onto the book in a little bit, but I want to just point out something that stopped me in my tracks. About two days ago, you posted something and you said, we were never meant to know all of life's troubles all of the time. No human condition was ever supposed to worry for all human conditions. And I thought, I had to show my husband. I said, she's nailed it. She's absolutely nailed it. We're all feeling so sort of upset by world events and the news reels, the news cycles are so toxic. We don't see anything good in there, but we have to curate. We have to feed our mind better, because as you pointed out, we've got to find the antidote to the news. Otherwise, all we're doing is flooding our heads, our bodies, our minds with this negativity. How do you deal with it? Donna : I mean, I've had to do this to survive my entire life. I think I've spoken about it quite a lot, but the first time I sort of had a breakdown was in university. And it was a news story that set me off then. Now, it would have been happening, the big change in my life, leaving home, going away to university, new stages, transitions. It was probably all happening. But that news story, that was me I went under. And I did not want to be on this planet anymore, where things like this were happening. And so I am somebody that has had to actively avoid the news for that reason, because there have been several news stories over the years, especially in vulnerable times. So when I was a new mum, it became a real point of contention in our home, because my husband watches the news constantly. And I, he would think, oh, she's being oversensitive, unreasonable. But the truth is, my mental health was so poor and so vulnerable that that news story about a child in danger or children in any kind of harmful situation, it would set me off. I would become depressed. I would go under as I term it. So I had to find ways of, I don't want to ignore, I don't want to be ignorant. We have to be aware of what's going on. But how can we possibly choose from a menu of 40 things in a day, each as bad as the other, each as horrific and, you know, as the other, which we can do nothing about. So what you have to do is you have to try and balance it out with all of the good stuff as well. Otherwise, you're only seeing everything that's wrong. You become helpless. You become, you know, you become so bogged down by the misery of it that you're no good to yourself, to your children, to your friends, never mind the world. So if you balance it out and make sure you're taking in all of the good stories as well, all of the ways in which humans save one another every day, and there are countless, but you have to work harder to find them, because they're not avidly, you know, available as the bad news. You have to work to find the good news stories. And if you also be present in your own world first, do what you can in your own world to make it what you want to see on the news. You want it to be peaceful. You want it to be loving. You want it to be kind. You want community. You want connection. That is something you can do in your vicinity right now. You can do some small thing. The ability to take step towards that stress is very good for your mental health, because you're taking action. Your nervous system feels safer. It feels more useful. You're involved. You're doing something, but this stress that you can't do anything about, if you're constantly taking that on board, you will sink. And yes, you can help. There are ways that we can all help, but it has to be, it has to be done. You know, put your own life jacket on first, put your own oxygen mask on first, otherwise you're no good to anyone. Michelle: You can find yourself in an echo chamber of perpetuating toxicity, can't you? And I've heard you say before that just taking a couple of minutes throughout the day to recalibrate, try and find, you know, it's hard to be a rainbow when there's so much dark, isn't there? And you have been described as sort of a rainbow spirit. You, you dopamine dress, you wear wonderful colours. Donna: Those are little tools that we can use as well to try and find the joy in our life by dressing in a way that makes us feel less invisible, more joyful, less dark. But I think everybody can find a few minutes to give themselves that self-care. It's the intention of it. And intention is a really important word in all of this. So the colours that I wear and the, you know, the things that I write, they're not a side effect of me being a wonderful, sunny human being. You know, they're not just, oh, this is just how I wake up every day and go, you know, give me all the color and look how happy I am. It's the opposite is true. I'm somebody who overthinks, is oversensitive, who's overanxious, who's, you know, an overachiever, too much, too much of all the things that you don't want to be too much of and not enough of the things that society wants you to have. So these are the ways in which I've found to help myself. If you, whatever you seek, you'll find. So if you wake up expecting disappointment, expecting misery, expecting things to go wrong, you're never going to be disappointed. You'll always find disappointment. You'll never be disappointed about that. But if you wake up and you decide, I'm going to seek all the ways in which little things go right. I'm going to seek all the ways in which people help one another. I'm going to look for all the little bits of magic and, you know, human connection and Mother Nature's magic, then you will never be disappointed because it's absolutely everywhere. And the more you train your own algorithm, the more it comes to you. I no longer naturally seek the pessimistic view. And I used to be a pessimist and I used to be someone who could not help, but see all of the ways in which something could go wrong. They're still available to me now if I want to look at them, all of the ways in which something can go wrong. And my list is like this. You know, I've had overthinkers say to me, oh, you're like me, you know, you have intrusive thoughts. And I'll say, yes, I bet you've also had the thought that this thing could happen any minute. And they've looked at me and gone, no, I wasn't thinking that at all. You've gone a whole new level. And I'm just like, oh, yeah. So, you know, my brain will automatically seek that. But on a daily basis now, it's joy seeking and it's light seeking and it's hope seeking, it's hope questing. And that makes a huge difference, just makes a massive difference and we can all do it. And it's the teeny tiny things. Michelle : Yeah, it's setting the tone, isn't it? And it's feeding the monkey. If you feed the monkey bad stuff, you're going to get bad stuff. If you feed the monkey something more holistic and happy and joyful, that's what you'll find. Now, I think that's a pretty good way into talking about your new anthology, Joy Chose You. It is an anthology of many of your different poems that you've drawn from all the different publications that you've had over the years. And it is absolutely beautiful, the cover of it. It is a stunning cover. And I don't know whether I'm right about this, but for me, it's one of those books that you can't really put on a bookshelf because it would seem wrong to cover up the cover. And I don't know whether your intention was to make sure that it is left out, because one of the things that you always talk about is 'the book knows'. To get someone to walk past, pick up a book, pick a random page and the book knows what you need to hear. You know what we need to hear because so often you will nail it on, I didn't even know I was feeling that way, or, oh yeah, that's exactly right, that's exactly what it is. So tell me a bit about your philosophy on how the book knows and how this book is really perfect for the whole family to just leave out on display or for a guest who's walking through. Donna : Yeah, well, thank you, first of all. And yes, it's a coffee table book because my followers have been asking me, I hate the word followers actually, I'm trying to think of a new word for that because it makes it sound like I'm just kind of walking along and everybody's walking behind me. The people who follow my page, there you go, that's better. They were after a coffee table book with some art in it because I often share some amazing art on my Facebook page especially. Sadly that's not possible because these amazing artists, their work is so incredible and obviously that's part of their portfolio and there's so many complications with putting art into a book. But I wanted to achieve the same effect and have it beautifully illustrated so that it feels like something special. I've been really clear about having just the words on a page, it's really important to me because the starker it is, somehow the better I think the message goes into your soul because you're looking at that page and you're going, that's a poem, that's so brave to stand on its own like that, it's a little quote, it's going to tell me something special. However, the illustrated, the beauty of it brings in so much more emotion as well because you're literally adding something, you know, a feast for the senses. So it's to be kept out and the more this book is kept out, you've hit the nail on the head, the more likely it is to be opened. And I always say to the children, because I've just released a children's book in doesn't matter if you've time to read it, but when you see it, open it. Because there's magic in that opening and you will see something, you might just see a word or two, you might just see a picture, but what it is that you see will be what you need in that moment. Now the science behind that, the book knows, it's not me that knows, it's you. And you know, magic in all these amazing, serendipitous, random happenings that we so love in my community and that I live for every single day. They're just science we can't prove yet. We know that a lot of our world exists in frequency and that everything that we do is actually electric and alive. And if we could see it, it would be incredible to watch the connection. So when you pick that book up, something is happening between you and the brain of which you only use a very small percentage of and the rest of your brain sees so much more than you know and knows so much more than you know. You choose the page yourself and you know what it is that you need. And all the book is doing is putting it in one place for you to be able to do that every day. But the magic is coming from you. Oh, I love that. So joy does choose you. And it finds you. Yep. So by putting each of your poems in isolation on a page, it's almost like the Mona Lisa on a wall. You don't have the distractions of other things so that you can really focus your intention on reading it and taking what it wants to give to you. And I think you and I have talked about this before that we're both neurodiverse. And I think that really lends a lot to but quietening the chaos so that you can deal with one thought at a time instead of many, many strands of thought. I can see your influence on the way that this book is illustrated and set out. Yeah, it's so important. You're so right as well. Because if you're overwhelmed, and that's why I always see that I write the way that I write chunks. I could go on and on and on about a topic, but I deliberately don't. Because what your mind needs exactly what you just said, it needs to explore that one thought and to quieten everything else down. And when we're overwhelmed, the last thing we can do is read a book. The last thing we can do is take in a lot of information or go into a lot of depth about something. You need to you need an emergency shot of something, you know, and you're a busy person, you have a busy life. These are straight to the point, little messages from my soul to yours to remind you what you already know, but to put it in focus and priority today or that particular day. And I am actually writing a book at the moment, a full book. And this is a quandary for me, because I don't want to lose that open a random page and get something very, very, you know, that jumps straight out at me and grabs me and goes, this is what you need to read right now. So how to do that in a very full book, because I've always, as you said, been very specific about having one small piece on a blank double page so that you're not reading something else straight away and taking you away from that thought. It needs time. You need to now go away about your day and let that little poem, that little quote percolate and marinate and decide what it means in your life and your world. So yeah, and it does, it works. Michelle: It absolutely works. Now you have garnered a lot of very famous fans. And I just want to read a couple of quotes that they have said about you, because these are big compliments, really big compliments. Robbie Williams says, if there is a God, Donna is doing her or his work. Well, that's not bad from Robbie. Susannah Constantine. Michelle and Donna at book event Donna: Can you imagine my face when I read that? It was a Monday morning and my social media started ping, ping, ping, ping, ping, ping. And I thought, what's Monday morning? What on earth could be happening? And he had just tagged me on Instagram on his Monday morning cuddle club. And he'd written that and he'd sent all these followers to give me a cuddle. That's what he does. How adorable is that? How adorable is that? And now I was a take that fan. And when I say a take that fan, I ditched the first day of sixth year at school as a prefect to go to Glasgow and queue outside HMV in my school uniform to meet, you know, take that, which was insane. So, I mean, I was a huge take that. They got me through a very difficult time. Michelle: They got us all through difficult times, didn't they? Like you, the lyrics just pierced your soul. The lyrics were what we're all going through, loves and losses and happy times. And it, you know, it takes you straight back there in many ways, doesn't it? To those teenage years. He said such lovely things about you. Did you manage to meet him? Donna: I didn't, no. That's one day. So I met him once, obviously, when I was 17. I'm sure he really remembers that! And yeah, you never know. And do you know what? Never I would just sort of collapse into a puddle. Oh my God. Because not only is it the connection from my childhood, but it's the community of the women who love take that. We're all in our forties and fifties now. We get it on impact. You know, we know exactly what it meant to us. We know what it- it's community, it's bonding, it's connection. It always comes back to exactly the same thing. And that little, you know, moment in time is a version of us that lives inside the dolls, you know, the doll inside the doll, inside the doll, inside the doll. So we connect on that instantly. And it's the sort of full circle moment, isn't it, of well, I'm an adult now, but that little doll that lives- I still have that teenage feeling, yeah. Those butterflies. I'm delighted that Robbie Williams, you know, and yeah, we all just get it because we've all been there. Michelle: Well, Davina McCall sent Yellow, your wonderful poem, Yellow, into orbit. She, huge, huge fan of yours. Also, Bryony Gordon, Dawn French. And I like this one from Susannah Constantine who said, "some people have the Bible by their bed. Others, a self-help manual, I have Donna Ashworth." Donna: I love, honestly, I adore that woman. And do you know what, the most amazing thing about all of these amazing women who've been kind enough to give me these words is that they've become friends. And, you know, if you'd have told me that five years ago, that would have seemed almost impossible. That's, you know, somebody who's worked for so long and I've been admiring of for so long and who's so fabulous and so successful. But the reality is they're just amazing women. And that's why we're so drawn to them on our TVs. And that's why we buy their books. And that's why we think that we love them because we do love them. And we all have that feeling, don't we? I reckon we'd be best friends. If we ever had a chance, I reckon I'd be best friends with this woman on my telly. And it's true, you would be. And that's why you admire them because they have all the qualities that you like in other women. They're just incredible. Michelle: You are that woman now, Donna. You are the woman that people want to be best friends with. And I think it helps as well that you're such an empath, that you really get people and you're very kind. And we've met in person and the first thing you do is give people a hug. You're just so... Don't ever change, will you? Donna: I don't think I could. Trust me, I tried for many, many, many years. You know, I tried to change all the things about me that were too much like giving everybody a cuddle. But you're not meant to do it. Well, as you say, acceptance. You have to accept yourself whether it's for good or for bad. You have to accept if you're going to live with grief or anxiety or sadness in your life. And that's the only way that you can live your life, but find the joy to add to it, right? And I mean, we're all, you know, there's elements of me that are dorky and too much. And I'm always making funny faces and I'm always doing ridiculous things with my hands. And I'm never going to be that poised, graceful, you know, ethereal being that quite frankly would probably be useful to me in the job that I do, you know? I think it would be intimidating. You just be you, Donna. I can't help it. I'm always going to be... There's a photo of Davina and I from a couple of weeks ago when she very kindly brought me onto her stage on her night with Davina and asked me to read the poem Yellow, which was... I mean, the best invitation of my year. And we were so excited to see each other that there's a photo of us when we're both just doing the most ridiculous... Like the excitement's too much, so we're just like, you know, we've become some weird creatures. And it's my favourite photo ever because... That's real. I know that feeling when you meet people who you really enjoy. Like when we met each other in the summer, you know, we've only spoken once or twice, it's like, I've been dying to properly meet you in real life. Michelle: Oh, you're so sweet. You are so sweet. Donna: And it's just joyful to let it go and be... The trick with everything, Michelle, is to not be afraid to be delighted and to show that you're delighted, to be easily pleased by everything. If you can be easily pleased once every hour of every day, you're winning at life, you know? And some people will look down on you and say, oh, God, I've just been writing notes to all these women to go with my new book. And I always put a little heart on the eye of their name. And I'm 50. And I sit there and I think, isn't it wonderful that I still heart my eyes to the women in my life that I know will totally appreciate this beautiful little piece of stationery that I bought that has gold foil on it and this pen that I'm writing with. And it's a proper love language, but you're also loving your inner child at the same time by allowing yourself to still, you know, heart your eyes. And look at your fingernails. People can't see her fingernails, but they are a rainbow. There's green and pink and red and yellow. These are from the happy place. They're from the last happy place. And there's my neon. And every time I look... And do you know what happened yesterday? So I was driving down this little country road just behind my house, and there was two women in the middle of this lane. It's a road, but it's really a lane as well. So you have to give way. And they were both doing that with their nails. They were looking at each other's nails in the middle of the road. So I had to stop the car and they were like, oh, oh, oh, sorry. And I just rolled my... Well, pressed the button window down and went, look at mine. I adore that story. Oh my gosh, it's just gorgeous. They were really taken aback because I guess that's not really a normal thing to do. And as I drove away, I thought, oh, that was a bit cringed on it, even for me. But then I reminded myself that these little things that you do, they will walk away. And maybe a minute later, they'll go, that was so funny. Takes a second. It can land awkwardly at first when you tell somebody, I love your dress or, oh my goodness, your hair. You know, at first they can be taken aback by it, but that grows in the night when they're alone. That little compliment takes root and grows. And it also comes from that ADHD impetuous honesty that is hard to hold back, isn't it? And it's that blurting out of, oh, I love what you're wearing. Or, oh, I wish I had your skin. Your skin's cool. I must say, I do that quite a lot. And people look at me like, you're a bit of an odd bird, aren't you? But that's okay. Michelle: Let's turn to some of your choices. Because how on earth did you choose the ones that went into the book? You have a lot to choose from. Did you choose every one or did you ask your publisher to go through it with you? How did you make that choice? Donna: I asked my lovely editor, Susanna, to choose her favourites. I went through and I chose all the poems that had gone viral. Because once a poem has been shared a certain amount of times, it's no longer yours to, you know, it belongs to lots of people who used it in a part of their life. So whether it was to a friend in need or at a funeral or at a wedding, these are little moments, but they mean a lot. So every poem that had done that thing went straight in, no question whether I like it or not. There's a lot of people out there who have used that in a moment in their life and that's for them. And then my favourites went in. And of course, as soon as the book went to print, Michelle, I remembered about 10 that I should have put in. Of course I should have put in because they're favourites and sadly they're not in it. But you have to stop somewhere. And I had to put new ones in. I didn't want it just to be a collection of the favourites because, you know, this book is beautifully designed, but it's a bit more expensive than my other books and I'm always aware of that. And I want to make sure that people get, you know, for their money, if they're going to use their money to buy a book of mine, I want it to be really, really worth it and really have as much as I can get in it. So I wanted new ones in there for people who know all of my work and are waiting on new ones. But yeah, it was a tough choice. Michelle: I can only imagine. Do you ever worry that you might run out of words? Donna: Oh, never. I did at one point, there was one point where I was doing three books on the same day. They were coming out on the same day. Life, Love and Loss came out three books on one day. And I look back and I think, why did I do that? That was bonkers. Because I was fighting myself for a place in the charts, which was just silly. That is silly, isn't it? Really silly. What you live and you learn. And I wondered what if I'm throwing too much out at once and, you know, I might run out. But as with everything in life, you change. Every few months, you're a different version of you. Your life is in a different stage. Your children are at a different stage. Your friends are at a different stage. Everything is constantly evolving and growing. So there is always a new perspective, maybe even on the same topic, because you're coming at it from a different phase and you're a different version. So I might write about the same topic over and over again. And it will appeal to different people each time I do it because they're in the same phase as me at that point, or they feel the same way. So I don't think I'm ever going to run out because everybody keeps giving me lots of inspiration. Well, here's one thing that I picked up on Empty Nest. That's in there. And of course, that's a new phase, perhaps, of your life as your children have grown up and started to leave the home. Michelle: And that will resonate because we're all of us. I'm older than you, but we're all of that age. And as we go through that iteration of our children needing us less and then actually moving out of the house, Empty Nest is a really beautiful poem. So yes, as you get older and perhaps as you become a grandmother, you'll be looking at things in a different perspective through different spectacles. Donna: And I don't have an empty nest. It's not here for me yet. I wrote that poem about five years ago when I definitely didn't have an empty nest. But again, it's with the overthinking. I have always been the type of person who wherever I am, I can see how that's going to feel in a year, two years, five years, ten years, which can be very overwhelming if your brain's giving you all at once. But once you write it down, it clears that out of your brain and you think, you know, that is for another day. I've explored it. I've had a little cry. I read Empty Nest yesterday to make a video on it. It made me cry. And both my kids have cried too. But again, that is, you know, the conundrum of motherhood and any kind of love. You always remind yourself what a gift it is in this moment. And if you're not reminding yourself of that, you should be. And I don't use the word shoot lightly, but that is one thing you should be doing, reminding yourself how lucky we are in every phase. If you've got the person that you love here, no matter what phase, whether it's a tough one or a golden one, you know, it's still a gift. Michelle: Well, I wonder, Donna, if I could finish up with one question and then beg you to read one poem, if you don't mind. But what do you read? What's on your bedside table? Donna: Well, that's an easy question. You Can Heal Your Life by Louise Hay. Very good. I don't actually even read this book. And actually, one of my friends, she's a bookstagrammer who has become a friend through her buying my books, bought me a beautifully illustrated edition of this. I don't have it to hand, sadly, which I will treasure forever. So Louise Hay, when I was 17, saved my life. And that's that end of story. So her voice lives in my brain. I don't even have to read this because it's in me. And her affirmations flow through my mind constantly. Sometimes I'm pretty sure she speaks to me from the other side. In fact, I know she does. So her book, Just to Have It Near, reminds me that it's near. And the energy of this book just, you know, is important to me. So Anything by Louise Hay, Anything by Louise Hay will bring you something vital. Michelle: Well, Anything by You will bring you something vital. And I wonder if I might persuade you, as it is the title of the book, would you be kind enough to read Joy Chose You? Donna: I would love to. this time, it's beautifully illustrated, which I do think adds something lovely to this poem. So here we go. This one is called Joy Chose You. Joy does not arrive with a fanfare on a red carpet, strewn with the flowers of a perfect life. Joy sneaks in as you pour a cup of coffee, watching the sunlight hit your favourite tree just right. And you usher joy away because you're not ready for her. Your house is not as it should be for such a distinguished guest. But joy, you see, cares nothing for your messy home or your bank balance or your waistline. Joy is supposed to flip through the cracks of your imperfect life. That's how joy works. You cannot truly invite her. Not really. You can only be ready when she appears and hug her with meaning. Because in this very moment, Joy Chose You . Michelle: I love it. It's so beautiful. And it does remind us that we forget to notice those joyful moments. Donna: We do. And just one sort of final thing. There is a lot to be said for choosing joy and seeking joy. But the reality is we forget to be just me. And as you are in that state of just being, that's when you're most open to receiving the real true joys, which are the real simple joys. They are the things that are free. They are the things are easy. They're the things that are all around, which we are not seeing when we are choosing joy in the big things. You know, we're chasing it. We're booking nights out. We're booking holidays. We're trying to create joy. And actually, joy doesn't need any of that stuff. It just needs you to have your eyes open and to be quiet sometimes so that she can sneak in. Michelle: Well, Donna Ashworth, thank you so much for joining me again. And this book is out now. It is called Joy Chose You. It is an absolutely gorgeous, gorgeous present for anybody for Christmas or just at any time in their lives. You know, you're sending a message to someone that you really care if you give them a Donna Ashworth book. That is for sure. Thank you so much. Lovely to see you. You can find more from Donna Ashworth here . Her book is available from Amazon here . Listen to the episode on Spotify here or on Apple Podcasts here

Michelle's Book Club TWC has welcomed celebrities, experts and authors to the podcast. If you want to read more, here's an easy way to track down their publications. Now, in partnership with Brooklands Radio , every month Michelle picks a new book of the month to share with listeners and followers - plus a weekly radio segment on Thursday afternoons at 2pm recommending a fiction or non-fiction book and, occasionally, a podcast or audiobook - featuring authors on air to chat about their books. Listen to Brooklands Radio on DAB, on smart speaker, via the app or online at www.brooklandsradio.co.uk . If you miss Book Club on Thursday afternoons, you can download and listen to the Brooklands podcast here . Subscribe to newsletter here In partnership with Brooklands Radio Michelle's Book Club every Thursday at 2pm Book Club Titles November Book Choice 59 Minutes by Holly Seddon AUTHOR ON AIR INTERVIEW ON BROOKLANDS RADIO COMING 6 NOVEMBER If you knew you had fifty-nine minutes until everything and everyone you love would be lost forever, what would you do with that time? It's an ordinary evening. People are coming home from work, cooking dinner for their children, cuddling on sofas with their lovers. And then the message arrives, shattering everyone's worlds: Missiles are set to destroy England in fifty-nine minutes. Everyone should seek immediate shelter. 59 minutes follows the journey of three women trying to make it home to and protect their families. The journeys should be simple, but with a lost schoolchild seeking help, a teenage daughter suddenly going missing, and dangerous criminals on the prowl, there is peril at every corner. Click to listen to author chat Buy 59 Minutes Brooklands Radio Book Club - authors on air Giveaway! ✨🎄 Your Festive Book Elf is here with a Christmas giveaway! 🎄✨ 
To celebrate the season of giving and my fabulous book club guest next week @donnaashworthwords , I’m spreading a little extra bookish magic… 
I’m giving away a signed copy of Joy Chose You by Donna Ashworth - the perfect uplifting Christmas gift for yourself or someone you love. 💛📚 ✨ How to enter: 
➡️ Follow @michelleford_twc and @brooklandsradio 
 ❤️ Tag your book-loving besties in the comments - each tag = one entry
 📲 Share to your stories and tag us for a bonus entry 🗓️ Deadline: Wednesday 17 December at midnight 
🎁 Winner announced: Thursday 18 December on Brooklands Radio during my Book Club segment and on Instagram Your Festive Book Elf can’t wait to sprinkle a little joy your way… good luck! 🎅📖✨ 🎙️ Don’t miss my Book Club chat with Donna on Thursday 11 December at 2pm on Brooklands Radio - tune in on DAB, online, on our free mobile app or just ask your smart speaker to “play Brooklands Radio”! This giveaway is not sponsored, endorsed, or administered by Instagram. Winners will be contacted directly by Michelle Ford. Please don’t fall for any scams - I will contact the winner directly from this account. Podcast Guest Publications click on image to buy Sue Cleaver A Work in Progress Engaging and wise, A Work in Progress will resonate with every middle-aged woman who feels newly invisible, silenced, underestimated or diminished. From knowing our worth, looking ahead with excitement and possibility, and realising that we still have so much to give and enjoy, this is a book that will change lives. Donna Ashworth Growing Brave In this powerful new collection of wisdom and poetry, Donna Ashworth helps us to find strength and courage on the days we feel lost, to pick ourselves up when times are hard, to soothe fear and self-doubt when we are in their grip, and to let in more life and love as we brave our challenges. Prue Leith Life's Too Short to Stuff a Mushroom Chef and TV legend Dame Prue Leith brings us the cookbook you’ve always wanted – delicious foolproof recipes, with accompanying kitchen shortcuts and hacks, for a lifetime of easy cooking. Every recipe in this book comes with a handy tip, plus you'll find over 25 videos accessed by a QR code to help you learn a skill or get ahead. Suzy Reading Self-Care for Winter: Seven steps to thriving in the colder months Self-care expert Suzy Reading has devised 7 steps to not only survive the winter months but to thrive in them. By embracing the lessons from the natural world - from regulating light activity to warming body movements - you will learn how to alter your daily rhythms so that you can embrace winter. Podcast Guest Publications click on image to buy Kate Rowe-Ham A Work in Progress In Owning Your Menopause, Kate Rowe-Ham proves it's possible to become fitter, calmer and stronger during menopause. Supported by her own personal menopause story and her experience as a personal trainer, Kate tells you everything you need to know to change your life for the better. Understanding and empowering, Kate's positive voice will transform your attitude to exercise with habit-changing strategies to help you feel the benefits. Susan Saunders The Power Decade The decade after the average menopause transition, from our 50s to 60s, is the most important for a woman's health. We are ageing in an environment that doesn't nurture midlife women and the reproductive hormones which protected our health for so long have waned. But this is also an opportunity to power ahead, to decide who we are and how we want to live as we face the future. Jessica Buchanan Impossible Odds On October 25, 2011, Jessica and a colleague were kidnapped at gunpoint and held for ransom by a band of Somali pirates. For the next three months, Jessica was terrorized by more than two dozen gangsters, held outdoors in filthy conditions, and kept on a starvation diet while her health steadily deteriorated. Her kidnap and eventual rescue by Navy Seal Team 6 will have you on the edge of your seat. Dilly Carter Change Your Space Dilly Carter, professional organiser and TV's decluttering supremo, shows you how to clear, re-organise and fall back in love with your space, whatever your situation. Changing your space is a process that requires a shift in mindset. However, the good news is you'll start noticing results with even the smallest changes; and with dedication and commitment you can reclaim your home, your time and your mind. Podcast Guest Publications click on image to buy Anthea Turner How to Age Well Anthea has written her own book on how to look great as we age, complete with her own tips and hacks and the expert advice she has received over the years. How to Age Well: The Secrets is a carefully researched, beautifully presented guide to ageing with style and grace. Anthea, who is renowned for her own glamorous look, has spoken to the experts for their tips and secrets – so you don’t have to. Anthea Turner & Wendy Turner Webster Underneath the Underground The first in the Mice series: It is two weeks before the King's Coronation and the British Asian Mice at Hounslow Underground Station are planning a fabulous party to celebrate. But disaster strikes when a huge glitter ball spins around and fails to shine! There's panic all round until clever mouse, Mo Low, has a fantastic idea - to take back the famous Kohinoor diamond from the Royal Crown and return it to the Indian community where it belongs! Judy Murray The Wild Card Twenty years ago, Abigail Patterson put her promising tennis career on hold to have her baby son, Robbie. But after a wild card entry to Wimbledon, she suddenly finds herself swept up in a world she thought she'd left behind - and against all odds, she's winning! Yet as those long-buried dreams of lifting the sparkling silver trophy on centre court inch closer, Abi knows that it's only a matter of time before the press start digging into her past and uncover the secret she's kept hidden for so long. Pauline Cox Eating for good health, happiness and hormones It's time to reset your hormones. What we eat matters. This ground-breaking cookbook with 100 simple, delicious and affordable low-carb recipes, will give you everything you need to balance your hormones and optimise your health for good - at any stage of your life. Women are increasingly suffering from a hormonal rollercoaster. From tricky puberty to endometriosis, mood swings or PMT, anxiety and adrenal fatigue, low fertility, poor sleep and tummy fat, plus many challenging menopausal and perimenopausal symptoms - this book is the solution to freeing yourself from the hormone trap.

From our sofa to yours… a couple of empty nesters figuring out life with all its ups and downs. Join Liz and Michelle and their community of listeners for a cuppa and a chat on Two Women Chatting! Here's season 10.... Apple podcasts Global Player In this warm, insightful, and laugh-out-loud episode, Michelle Ford sits down with presenter, counsellor, and podcast powerhouse Anna Williamson to explore one of midlife’s biggest topics: staying emotionally connected when life, family and festive chaos compete for your attention. Anna shares how emotional intimacy and active listening keeps long-term relationships thriving, why communication is usually at the heart of every issue, and how understanding the “seasons” of life can help couples navigate natural shifts - even after decades together. They also talk about the highs, lows, and emotional dynamics behind shows like I’m a Celebrity and Celebs Go Dating, where Anna works as an ‘agent’, and what those televised moments can teach us about connection in real life. With Christmas stress looming, Michelle and Anna dive into practical, compassionate strategies for avoiding conflict, setting boundaries, and staying emotionally connected to your partner. They explore how to find the spark again, how to handle tricky family dynamics without guilt, and why it’s important not to throw around the ‘D’ word. For those re-entering the dating scene in midlife, Anna offers empowering advice on embracing your worth, seeking companionship or romance, and approaching dating with confidence in your 40s and 50s. Welcome! The midlife space for laughter, inspiration and community At Two Women Chatting, we are passionate about supporting and empowering midlife women. Our platform is dedicated to offering informative, entertaining content that inspires, uplifts and offers helpful advice. Our podcast conversations cover an array of topics related to midlife such as health and wellness, relationships, the empty nest and self-discovery sometimes chatting about topics that are not comfortable but need to be discussed. As we research topics and guests for our podcast we discover amazing websites and platforms relevant to midlife women so we created a midlife library of blogs , resources , guides and contacts which are regularly added. If you are a woman in your 40’s, 50’s, 60’s or beyond this is your place, your sanctuary! Welcome to the community! love Michelle and the TWC team xxx I'm a 'professional empty nester'! Whether it's your first or last kid leaving the nest, this time of our lives is such a rollercoaster of emotions. Believe me - I get it. I've gone through it three times already and I think I can help you. I've got blogs, episodes and reels to help, guide and support. Check out my midlife library and type in 'empty nest' for great blogs. Listen to Before They Go , After They Leave and Flying the Nest (with Dr Dominique Thompson) and Louise Minchin episodes. Follow me on insta for supportive reels and to hear my chat with Dr Claire Kaye , executive coach and new empty nester. I'm excited to announce 'Michelle's Book Club' has now launched! In partnership with Brooklands Radio, I'll be sharing book recommendations, reviews and author interviews on air every Thursday at 2pm Click here to find out more. Recent authors on air have included Ruth Ware, Adele Parks, Donna Ashworth, Beth O'Leary, Milly Johnson, Sue Cleaver, Stella Rimington, Lisa Jewell, Louise Candlish, Judy Murray and Alexandra Potter Recent Blogs ADHD in Midlife? Why So Many Women Are Finally Getting Answers - A Conversation with Dr Helen Wall Midlife Tool Kit - Menopause Edition Donna Ashworth | Midlife Joy & Letting Go of Perfection Season 10 has now arrived! The new season launches on 30 September with the absolutely fabulous Elizabeth Day! If you enjoy the podcast or a particular episode, it would be FANTASTIC if you could follow, rate and leave a review. It makes a HUGE difference and it means more people will find it. Thank you xxx Click here for Spotify and here for Apple Podcasts When I'm not podcasting, empty nest travelling or writing you can find me on Brooklands Radio every Thursday afternoon broadcasting across Surrey and beyond. Listen on DAB, through your smart speaker, online, or the Brooklands Radio free app. So many ways! Featured Podcast Guests Some of my fab guests... including Dame Kelly Holmes, Dame Prue Leith, Dame Judi Dench, Dame Stella Rimington, Sue Cleaver, Andrea McLean, Claire Sweeney, Louise Minchin, Anthea Turner, Dr Nighat Arif, Judy Murray, Melinda Messenger, Angie Best, Lisa Snowden, Jenni Falconer, Lavina Mehta MBE, Jasmine Birtles, Jenny Seagrove, Carolyn Harris MP, Marianne Jones, Katy Hill, Bonnie Langford, Jenny Eclair Listen to the podcast Dame Kelly Holmes Dame Kelly Holmes Dame Prue Leith Elizabeth Day Elizabeth Day Dame Judi Dench on the best thing about being an older woman DONNA ASHWORTH Laura Hamilton on travel inspiration Louise Minchin on Empty Nest Syndrome and being Fearless in Midlife Michelle Griffith Robinson on being the sandwich generation and managing expectations Andrea McLean on loneliness and reinvention in midlife Dr Nighat Arif on Female Heart Attacks Anthea Turner on how to survive divorce Judy Murray on becoming a novelist Jenni Falconer on benefits of collagen in midlife Dame Kelly Holmes Dame Kelly Holmes Dame Prue Leith Elizabeth Day Elizabeth Day Dame Judi Dench on the best thing about being an older woman DONNA ASHWORTH Laura Hamilton on travel inspiration Louise Minchin on Empty Nest Syndrome and being Fearless in Midlife Michelle Griffith Robinson on being the sandwich generation and managing expectations Andrea McLean on loneliness and reinvention in midlife Dr Nighat Arif on Female Heart Attacks Anthea Turner on how to survive divorce Judy Murray on becoming a novelist Jenni Falconer on benefits of collagen in midlife Dame Kelly Holmes Dame Kelly Holmes Dame Prue Leith Elizabeth Day Elizabeth Day Dame Judi Dench on the best thing about being an older woman DONNA ASHWORTH Laura Hamilton on travel inspiration Louise Minchin on Empty Nest Syndrome and being Fearless in Midlife Michelle Griffith Robinson on being the sandwich generation and managing expectations Andrea McLean on loneliness and reinvention in midlife Dr Nighat Arif on Female Heart Attacks Anthea Turner on how to survive divorce Judy Murray on becoming a novelist Jenni Falconer on benefits of collagen in midlife Midlife Library Our evolving Midlife Library is packed full of informative and relatable information. As we research for our blogs and podcasts we discover websites and platforms that we think are useful for midlife women. It covers an array of topics including Career & Purpose, Beauty & Fashion, Health & Wellness, Lifestyle & Travel, Money & Finance and Home & Family. The Midlife Library is regularly updated as we research and uncover new information. Explore the Midlife Library "Love the mixture of humour and really fascinating topics. I don't know how Liz and Michelle get such fabulous guests. Look forward to this every week and have shared with so many friends!" “Exactly what I need in my Podcast library as I adjust to instant empty nest with twins having just left for college! Looking forward to the next episode!” "Really appreciate how they chat about subjects that can be awkward or uncomfortable and still manage to do it with humour. I've learned so much from listening to this podcast when I walk the dog." “Really feel like I'm part of the conversation and keep wanting to join in! I feel like they're my friends! Great podcast! Sign up

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